Talk:Sanpete County, Utah

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Revision as of 18:33, 18 March 2009 by RitcheyMT (talk | contribs) (smithing)

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Fairview has a museum - it houses historical as well as individual genealogical contributions.

This will be taken care of when the city pages are created in due time. dsammy 20:16, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

familyjournals- you succeeded in BLOWING up the section so BIG, it now taking up almost entire window instead of 1/3. BAD PRACTICE! dsammy 21:02, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

Cemeteries belong on cities/towns pages. dsammy 21:05, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

Sammy we are in the middle of a lesson on the wiki. Would you please leave things alone. Thank you. Familyjournals

I was working on city pages when you undid it. dsammy 21:15, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

That is not true and you are giving me a great example of bad behavior. You also just took out information from a brand new user on the Fairview Page. Familyjournals

This exchange violates Wiki policy on treating wiki contributors with fairness and civility.

Dsammy using CAPS and words like blowing up and telling someone what they are doing is bad practice is not proper etiquette.  There is no policy in the wiki that Cementeries belong on cities/towns, that is logic and personal preference.  Please do not enforce personal preference or logic. I have a cemetery near my house that is on unincorporated county land, it could not go on a city or town page.

Familyjournals, accusing someone of bad behavior is also not fair or civil.  I know there is a history here between you two that is not on this page but is spread over many pages.  Nevertheless, a casual observer seeing only this page would think that both of you are violating policy with your directness and rude tone.

I am going to plead with both of you to back away from each other's pages.  I am asking for a voluntary moratorium, please stay away from each other for at least a week until we can get this all sorted out.

I need to tell you that I appreciate both of your desires to help with the wiki, I know your hearts are in the right place.  And so I hope you will see that mine is too.

Jimgreene 18:31, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Will do. Sounds good to me! Thank you Jim. Familyjournals 18:35, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

I just noticed a potential problem with the truce. Whose page is this? The History shows that although lately Familyjournals has made most of the edits, Dsammy made his first edit of this page on 6 May <2008>, while Familyjournals' first edit here was 14 March <2009>. If "ownership" is calculated by first edit, Sammy would be the owner of this page. 

That said, I don't think first edit really matters here so much. If first edit were the deciding factor of all conflicts on a page, then a user could set up "squatter's rights" on thousands of pages just by creating stubs for them. That practice wouldn't ensure the pages in question would have the best guidance, now, would it? 

The larger issue in this specific conflict between Familyjournals and Dsammy is enforcement of a style that is not a policy. Dsammy feels that all cemetery listings should be tied to a town, whereas Familyjournals feels that wouldn't work for all cemeteries and thus cemeteries should be listed at a county level. Dsammy feels his method is enforceable. I don't agree because the community hasn't ruled on even a best practice regarding this issue, let alone a policy. In my opinion, best practices are generally encouraged but not enforced; policies generally are both encouraged and enforced. But neither a best practice or policy is documented on this wiki regarding this issue, so no matter how much anybody supports either side here, neither side is <enforceable>. 

Do we have a "three reverts" rule yet? That would apply here, because these two users are reverting each others' edits. I'm guessing at least three reverts have occurred, whether they occurred in the form of a rollback or simply an editing out of another user's changes.

To really solve this conflict, we'd need one of three things.

  1. A three reverts rule (the third revert would be the last, no matter who makes it).
  2. A ruling on who owns this page (the non-owner would have to withdraw from the edit war).
  3. A ruling by the community on which method we should use to link cemeteries (the county method or the town method). 

Ritcheymt 21:31, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

(The following is an excerpt from an e-mail sent from Dsammy to Ritcheymt in response to Ritcheymt's comments above. See Ritcheymt's post below this post.)

Common sense, not enforcement. And it was pointed out to me by others
the need to relocate the cemetery information as soon as the city/town
pages become available.

Think carefully, when you see in obituaries, death certificates, family
records, they mention towns.

By the very nature of the record, you go straight to the town, not county.

And incidentially every one of those cemeteries in Sanpete are located
within the towns, very unlike those up in Box Elder or down in Juab
counties where some cemeteries are way out in middle of nowhere far
from any town.

And I had this very simple line that she deleted. This is same line that
shows up in quite a number of counties throughout USA.

An experience today only reinforced the town first approach. A lady was
looking for Goshen, she was NOT looking for Utah County. She went
straight to that town because that is what her family record said.

I asked one of Library staff for her astute opinion, she said it is the
nature to go straight to the town first.

I can understand listing of cemeteries on the county page only IF there
are NO town pages.

<here Michael snips out some of Dsammy's e-mail>

I am trying to figure out how to grow Salt Lake City more because of lot
of information available for the city alone (hundreds of church records,
15 cemeteries within the city boundary, something I brought up to Fran
to consider.) Dsammy 22:25, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Dsammy sent me the e-mail above because he thought he was not allowed to continue this discussion here. As community and content manager of this wiki, I'm going to clarify something and tweak the community's understanding of what Jimgreene said. (Jimgreene is the product manager.) Jim was right in asking FamilyJournals and Dsammy to stop the edit war on pages they both care about. However, Jim's appeal for that edit war to stop has left at least one of you believing you can't continue the discussion here. Preventing that discussion will just delay a solution, so I'm instructing Dsammy and Familyjournals now to continue posting on this discussion page the merit of your ideas regarding whether cemeteries should be linked from the county pages or the town pages. What you should not post is further edits to genealogical content pages on which you conflict. I am also going to invite some cool heads (James Anderson, Jimmy Parker, and David Dilts) to weigh in to this discussion. Above this post, you will find a post I added here which captures most of Dsammy's e-mail to me. I've going to sign it with his username, but I want everyone to understand he did not post it; I did. (So please, admins, don't discipline him for posting.) Ritcheymt 18:10, 18 March 2009 (UTC)